Speaker 1 0:00

Yello, this is Rambles and Shambles with Ana, a podcast about work, leadership, and the mess in between. Today I'm chatting with Kata. I've heard a lot about her for like 30 years because our mums are friends. And we've been clocking around 50 kilometers of walking every week since she's been visiting. She's back home at the moment, which means old school reports have been resurfacing. Before we get into work and travel and everything else, what was little Kata like at school?

Speaker 0:26

Well, little Kata at school was quiet. That's how I remember me. However, looking at my school reports, as Ana just mentioned, it seems like in grade two I was a talker because my grade two teacher actually wrote in my report that I talk a bit too much. Whereas in all the other grades, I was told that I'm quiet in class. So I don't know what happened in grade two that I spoke a lot, but obviously something did. Either that or the teacher didn't like me. I don't know.

Speaker 1 0:57

I think you're back to the grade two version of you.

Speaker 1:00

Yeah, I'm no idea.

Speaker 1 1:02

A year to remember. I love it. Too long ago. So when you think back to being a kid, what did you gravitate towards?

Speaker 1:10

Well, as a child, I loved writing letters. I loved writing letters to my pen pal in Italy because back then there used to be some type of an organization that would organize these pen pals, and you can choose the country and you can match up with a person. So I had a friend in Italy called Paola. I used to get letters from her every two or so months. So you'd send the good old fashioned postcard. That used to be fun. The other person that I used to write to as well was in Queensland. I met her when my auntie's brother was in the defense force. We were the same age and we became pen pals as well. And thinking of that, what I wanted to be was a postman.

Speaker 1 1:54

Not a writer. I'm not a writer.

Speaker 1:56

A postman because I love getting letters. Not writing the letters. I loved receiving the letters. You know, the stamps that you used to get. I mean, unlike now with where they have the electronic ones, which, you know, are very mundane and really there's not much you can do with it. You can't put it in a in a stamp book as you did back then, because that was the other thing that I used to do, collect stamps.

Speaker 1 2:18

Very cool. Very cool.

Speaker 2:21

So yeah, so I wanted to be a um postman because I wanted to deliver such letters to other people. Needless to say, I um didn't know anything about bills at that age because if I did, I probably would have uh thought about being something different. But the other job that I wanted to be, well, it's not really a job, I actually wanted to be a nun. Uh the reason why I wanted to be a nun was because my aunt is a nun and she was the coolest person around. She lives overseas. She used to send me gifts all the time, and I just thought, my gosh, she's just having the best time. And that's why I thought being a nun might be good. But then I discovered boys in high school, but that's another story.

Speaker 1 3:01

So were you someone who followed the rules or did you test them a little bit?

Speaker 3:05

No, I was I was a rule follower. I listened to school teachers. My language school teacher, for example, used to say that I was the only student that actually listened to her. The others didn't. I was the only one that that used to do my homework. And all the kids used to go, tell the teacher that you didn't do your schoolwork. You know, that way we're not going to get into trouble. I go, but I've done my schoolwork. But no, just just tell them that that you didn't. I'm going, but I did. So a few times I told the teacher that I didn't, and they were shocked, you know, and horrified that I didn't do my homework. But I had done my homework. You just blamed it on the stamp collecting. You were too busy. I was, I'm just wanting to please everybody and fit in. And sometimes I lied and said that I didn't do it, whereas most of the times I said, I did it, and bugger you. If you haven't done your homework, that's not my problem. But the teachers absolutely loved me. The only teacher that said something about me was in year 10. My classroom teacher was also my PE teacher. My mother used to go for parent teacher interview. So English and maths, no issue. Classroom teacher, she said Cartha in class is fine. For um geography, no issues there. She goes, as for PE, Cartha is very unfit. She um needs to do more exercise. We have aerobics every lunchtime in the school gym. She um should come and do aerobics. So my mother came home and blasted me. Not because of my schoolwork, but because the teacher said that I was unfit. So lo and behold, on the following week on the Monday, I went to school with my gym stuff. Went in, changed, walked in, and I went, nah, this isn't for me. And walked back in. She tried, we tried. That's the way. And I lied to my mother that I actually went in a row picks. I'm getting a theme of lying, haven't we? Well, yeah, well, it's you know, tweaking things. Because I mean, I did get changed in my gym outfit. But um, yeah, me and sport just not it. The other thing I I can tell you about school, especially high school, um, back then we used to have diaries. And that's where you'd put in all your homework. And if you were unwell or if you couldn't do like anything for PE, that's where you would put notes for the teacher. So, what did Kartha do? She'd write dear PE teacher at the time. Kartha is unable to undo PE because she has a headache. And that lasted, those headaches lasted for months. And it happened to be always on the day of the PE. And I got my father to sign it. My father trusted me. He just went ahead and signed it. It wasn't until the um school teacher mentioned it. Kartha, you know, kept saying that she's unwell. And Mum goes, I've not signed anything. Because, well, there's a lot of being signed. When mum came home and asked me who's been signing, because she thought that I'd been forging her signature. I said, No, dad signed. And so dad got into trouble as well. Outsourced the trouble. And then dad came to me actually and said, Carter, what happened? And I told him what happened. He goes, Oh, that's okay then. So he was fine with the he thought it was bad, but I said, No, it's only PE, Dad. He goes, That's okay.

Speaker 1 6:08

And I love that, bless you.

Speaker 6:10

So, what did you end up studying? In the end, after I found out about the whole bills and everything else, I ended up studying IT. But the other thing is, in high school, I wanted to be a record producer, but I realized you need to have a knowledge of a lot of instruments. I barely had a knowledge of one instrument. And no, it's not the Ryam Corda third. So I knew that my talent wasn't there as much as I would have loved to have done it because I absolutely love music. That just didn't happen. So I went into IT instead. Why? I thought it was that fun and game stuff. The whole email had just started basically. The email addresses were like 50 pages long before the at symbol appeared, and then the rest was like another 50 pages long. So there was a lot of writing it down and copying it in because it was this was before copy and paste. I was the only female to graduate in IT. A lot of the other females, unfortunately, had either failed classes or they thought, nah, this isn't for me, and actually pivoted into business. Pivoted. Pivoted. But I hung hung on there, ended up finishing the course.

Speaker 1 7:17

So essentially you became the postman in the end, anyway.

Speaker 7:22

I became a bit a bachelor of IT.

Speaker 1 7:26

We won't finish with a CH at the end of that. So was there a moment where you thought, well, you were studying that, oh wow, this actually suits me?

Speaker 7:37

No. I did it because back then IT was the in thing. And I knew that it would give me an opportunity to get a job because back then there was a lot of economic downturn. So I really wanted to be employable and and not just get a degree for the hell of it and then come out of it and you can't do anything with it. What had actually happened after I had finished my degree, I tried to look for a job, but nobody wanted a um graduate with no experience, which is what I unfortunately had, no experience. And so I was basically putting in applications left, right, and center, in in my local area, and then interstate and anywhere, anywhere that I could. And at one stage, I don't know where I was posting my resume to and applications, but eventually I ended up getting a job. Somebody wanted me, and I ended up being the only female in the IT division. I was looked after by the boys, which was really nice. They really took care of me there. So I started doing coding. Um, hated it. I had no, I realized that I had no talent, and then I got into IT support, which I really enjoyed because that meant that I moved around a lot more. I got to work outside the office as well, helping set up systems. So it was a good job, but I was getting very bored with it. And eventually I ended up moving organizations and I totally flipped, went and become a normal officer, so to say. A normal public servant. Oh, a servant by public. That's right. And how it shouldn't up there. What a what a flip. A major flip. So I ended up just wanted to change after nine years where I'm so doing IT. I uh took five weeks of holiday because I had lots of holiday up my sleeve, and I went to try out and I really liked it. And my manager at the time also liked me the um way I worked and wanted me back. So I ended up go going back to my old job, quitting, and two weeks later I went back and I um started there.

Speaker 1 9:40

Wait, so you left the company of nine years? Yes. You took a five-week break?

Speaker 9:45

No, I actually took my holidays, yeah, and I went and worked at the other company for five weeks.

Speaker 1 9:52

Uh you see.

Speaker 9:52

I told them that I was going on holidays, but I really wasn't. Oh. Um well, sort of a holiday. It was some something different. Just to see how everything worked and uh everything operated, and also if it works for me and it works for the employer. I loved it. The employer loved me in return. So I went back to my original job, quit, and then two weeks later started back. I see. A little trial. That's right. A bit of a trial. It it it was a good thing to do to make sure that everyone was happy because unfortunately, a lot of people don't get that opportunity. They they go, well, you know, this this is going to be fabulous and whatever this job in in organization X. They go in and they go, nah, this isn't for me. Or they might think that they're loving it, but maybe management isn't. They're thinking this person may be, I don't know, too slow or you know, isn't grasping the concept. There's a lot of hand holding that shouldn't happen, or just the whole culture of the person, maybe the person's behavior. There's something about them that, you know, just doesn't mesh with the culture of the organization. There could be lots of factors. So this was a good opportunity to um see, as I said, how I work, what management thought of me, and if it meshed well, great. If it didn't, oh well, you would have gone back.

Speaker 1 11:07

Correct. So do you remember what it felt like after those nine years? What kind of conversation you had with yourself to say it's time for something different?

Speaker 11:15

Because I'm a person who doesn't move about a lot. I'm a person that likes to stay stationary when it comes to homes, when it comes to job, because I am come from a family where, you know, uh if I've only had those couple of jobs, that's it. Haven't come from a family or parents, especially, who've worked from one job to another job to a third job and in their lifetime, you know, 50 jobs. So for me, it um was a big decision, but I knew that I had to make that leap because I wasn't happy. I truly wasn't happy and I needed to do do something about it. But I again I didn't want to go into something that didn't make me happy, number one. Number two, that wasn't secure. Doing a job that only only gave me a minimal contract or something, that would have been too scary for me because I liked that certainty. Luckily, back then there was a lot of opportunity to get full-time employment, unlike these days where everything's basically contract-based. Having that certainty, knowing that I'd be able to get full-time employment gave me that leap of faith to say, okay, I feel safe to move, I can do it.

Speaker 1 12:18

When you say you wanted to be happy in your new workplace, how would you describe happiness in the workplace for you?

Speaker 12:24

Happiness to me means liking the um the work that you're doing. That's number one. And the other big one is also your colleagues. If you mesh well and you gel well with bit with colleagues, then that makes life much easier. I've been lucky. I've always had good colleagues. As I said, did IT, did coding, hated it, went and did IT support that I liked, but started getting bored with it. In my current organization, I've worked my way up the ranks. I enjoyed the training that I got. Yes, there's been some managers that haven't been that good, but generally speaking, they've been good. You know, especially my current manager, I can speak very highly of, and my first manager. Those two sort of equal when it comes to how they manage because they're firm in their judgment. So they recognize people that actually do the work and they don't put extra pressure on you just because you are a worker, because that's the type of worker I am. I'll um, you know, pull all stops to get things done. Some management see that and they go, great, let's just keep dumping more work on this person. Well, you know, that isn't fair. It's different if I ask for the work, but it makes it hard when it's dumped on you. When you see other colleagues that are getting less and less work because they just can't handle it. It makes it unfair. But when you're recognized, when you're recognized for the amount of work that you do and the output that you give, you know, just gives you that little bit more incentive to do extra and to go that extra mile. Yeah, I like that.

Speaker 1 13:53

You're talking about managers that you really enjoy working with and your face lights up when you talk about them. I'm just wondering how long it took for you to trust your manager and and what they did to actually make you realize that they do respect and take take care of you.

Speaker 14:08

Basically, I like to give managers the benefit of the doubt. I like to see how they work, how they operate. People can tell you their version of the person that I'm me. I know what works for me, I know what doesn't work for me. And when I see the manager working to my benefit in the sense that they can recognize that that a person is putting in the effort, doing possibly more than what they um should be, recognizing that, that is a plus. When I see managers dumping work on colleagues, whether that be me or other colleagues, just because they are workers, whereas other colleagues who aren't doing the work as they should be, not getting the work, it it makes it hard. So it basically starts with that benefit of the doubt. And when you see that, just makes life easier for you. When that doesn't happen, then that's an uphill battle. That's when you become disillusioned. That's when you start looking sideways and looking at at other opportunities, whether that's within the organization or anywhere else. I suppose you try and find excuses not to come to work. And it just makes life really, really difficult. That's why I'd like to try and work with a manager who understands me, who understands management, who's real about management, who isn't just airy fairy and, you know, biased and likes this person just because they're their friend or whatever, that should not be part of it. Um, they should base it on merit.

Speaker 1 15:36

And during your working life, would you say you've ever had a manager that was very much so an uphill battle?

Speaker 15:42

I can't say that. I can think of a case where I was doing my usual work and then I was asked to help out another team to um do their work. The other team liked me, well, the management of the other team liked me so much that they asked my then manager if I could come back and help out some more. And the manager said no, because they wanted me in that team because, of course, I was doing a um a lot of the work. I was one of those staff members that was doing a lot of the work for a couple of people. My big manager got a twig of this information and they came and saw me and asked me what did I want to do. And I said, I would love to go back and do that other work because I found it interesting and just different to what I was currently doing. And um, that manager said, That's fine, I'll go and I'll speak to your line manager and I'll sort it. So they went and um spoke to my line manager. My line manager stopped being my line manager, not only for me, but for my whole team because of their management style. It didn't agree with this hire manager. They didn't think that that's how staff should be managed. If somebody had the capability and had the willingness to go and learn something new that should be applauded, just because they are a capable worker in your team and you might need them, they should be given other opportunities as well if they seek that. So, yeah, so I ended up when I did come back, I ended up having another manager. So that was quite interesting.

Speaker 1 17:09

Yeah, you don't want managers who block your growth just because it makes it easier for them to manage their team because you're not going anywhere.

Speaker 17:15

That's right, that's right. It makes it hard. I mean, you should be able to be flexible to allow your own staff to move, to get some experience in other teams, because there could be some skills that they can learn in that team that they can bring, bring back to your team to make it even better than than than what it is. There are people that like to do the same old, same old. That's fine. There's there's some no right or wrong way of doing things. If a person, you know, likes to do new things and like to learn new things, give them the o the opportunity.

Speaker 1 17:45

Yeah, I think secondment culture is really positive because it keeps people in the same business and like you said, you learn skills somewhere else and you come back. Correct. Yeah, absolutely. Was there a moment at work where you doubted yourself more than you needed to?

Speaker 17:59

I mean it it happens quite a bit when you see other colleagues getting in and doing things and you're thinking, hang on, why aren't I getting that opportunity? What am what am I doing wrong? I mean, it could be that that I'm not doing anything wrong. The manager just wants to give that other person the opportunity, which is which is very fair. So those have probably been the only time where I've actually, you know, doubted myself and thought, what am I doing wrong? Is it me? Is it my work? Is it my personality? But it could just simply be, yeah, just just an opportunity for another person. Just like I want an opportunity. Other people also want the I'm same.

Speaker 1 18:35

Now I know that you love to travel. You've traveled to a gazillion countries.

Speaker 18:41

How do you make that work practically with your job? I make it work because of the leave that we have available. That's number one. Number two, being open with your manager, giving ample time to, you know, give them that that heads up. I think also my work ethic, knowing that I put in the effort when I am there so that I can have that on time off. The other thing is I I think that it's important that everyone has that one thing that they enjoy doing, whether that be traveling, if if someone likes running, you know, doing marathons, making time to go and do the Boston marathon, you know, j just finding that one thing outside of work that isn't related to your mortgage or your bills. I think that's important to have. It helps you keep focused, it helps you keep motivated, and it just gives you a purpose in life, just to have that thing that you do. That's why I like to tell people that, you know, everybody should have that at least that one thing to keep them motivated and um that'll make things easy, especially when things do get hard at work, when times are tough, when uh things are expected of you, where you are giving your you know 110%. You can sit there and go, listen, the reason why I'm doing this is because of this. So for me, it I love my traveling. So, what is it about travel that you love though? I love the opportunity to see new places. I love the opportunity to people watch. I just love sitting and just watching people. Yeah, it d um fascinates me how people react. You know, you can have one country where people are loud as and you can hear their whole conversations, people that are rude, and you can have people that are, you know, helpful as. It's very random. Everyone's experience is different. That's why not all of us like the same places. And the other thing that I like about traveling is I like flying. I love flying in in the airplanes. I just love, I suppose, getting served.

Speaker 1 20:40

She likes getting letters and she likes being served online.

Speaker 20:44

That's right. The one place you have control. I know you know what people bag out for plain food, and yes, plain food can be crap. But you know what? It's just the thing of, you know, you have to serve me. You've got no choice in the matter. Oh I just love it. Those little quirks, you know, even that glass of water that you have to give me, you have to give it to me with a smile.

Speaker 1 21:09

The customer's always right.

Speaker 21:11

I love it. Exactly. Exactly.

Speaker 1 21:14

Oh, Jimmy's help. So for you, other than getting served on the airplane, what would a perfect morning look like while you're traveling?

Speaker 21:22

A perfect morning would be waking up somewhere along a beautiful coast, beautiful hotel room. So you've got the view of the water, and it's a nice hot summer's day, and you can see a few people walking and whatever, no one's making any noise. That to me is just just the best. Waking up Tom that there's nothing worse than waking up and you can hear dogs barking or people yelling in the hallway. That's just just the worst, or doors banging. That's just awful. Silence. Yes. So the sea, the heat, the quietness is just a perfect holiday. Morning for me.

Speaker 1 22:01

Do you think your relationship with work has changed over time?

Speaker 22:04

I don't think so. I seem to be a workaholic and I don't know how not to be. And I guess that goes back to my family, especially my own dad, who used to work seven days a week. So you just get to understand that's how a person works. And so when you go to work, you just assume that's how everybody else works, that they just work, but you don't realise that other people might have a life. And for them it might be nine to five, and then that's it. But for me, it could be, you know, eight o'clock till midnight. I don't mind putting in and doing the the extra hours. So I suppose, yeah, being that alcoholic, it will never stop. Even now. Alcoholic or workaholic? Wow. I mean, even now, you know, going through cancer, I mean, I've been having a couple of months off. You can't help but think of work. And you can't help but be in contact with your colleagues to find out how things are going. Is there anything I can help with? Regardless that I'm on sick leave. And I shouldn't be thinking about that. That that should be the last thing on my mind. But it's still there because I don't know how to switch it off. Luckily, I don't have a work laptop with me. So I can't go in and find out what's been happening. So I just have to take at face value and just allow my colleagues to undo what they know best.

Speaker 1 23:22

Guys, she literally is a workaholic because she's offered to help me with Excel and Word. So I can so and I've said no because you're here, you're here, you're meant to be uh taking care of yourself and on on your sick leave.

Speaker 23:34

Well, you know, sometimes you're you're on board sitting in in front of the television and whatever, and that's times when you feel like you could possibly do something. So again, you don't mind helping people out if they need help. What surprised you about yourself through all of this? What surprised me is my resilience and also trying to make sure that that um things don't bother me as much as they used to. I used to get wound up about things. Now I just try and let things go because there's other things in life that should get you wound up and things haven't, like my cancer hasn't got me wound up. So if that hasn't got me, I don't think anything else should. That's one of the things that it's taught me. And I know that I can only control myself. I cannot control people around me. They'll do what they do, they'll think what they'll think, and there's nothing I can do. Management the same, regardless of what you tell them or not tell them, they'll just go ahead and do what they want to do. All you can do is speak up, speak your mind. If they take it on, great. If they don't, oh well, there's you know, not much you can do. And what's helped you on the harder days? What's helped me is um just prayer. Yeah, belief in God. That's number one. What's also helped me is I've got a good group of friends. I've got great family that I can rely on. Talking to people has definitely helped. The other thing that also helps is listening to music, putting on your headphones and just chilling right out. That also helps.

Speaker 1 25:06

Has this period shifted the way you think about time?

Speaker 25:09

I really don't think about time that much. Life can be short, life can be long, but life can be somewhere in between, but you just don't know. Yeah, just take every day as it comes, make sure that you're happy doing what you want to do. You're spending time with people that do make you happy, that are positive in your life. As I said, for me, it's traveling. For other people, it might be fixing a car. If that's what makes you happy, go for it.

Speaker 1 25:33

And you said that you've you've been surprised by your own resilience. But what do you think people get wrong about resilience?

Speaker 25:40

People probably doubt themselves the most. They think, oh, that they're not resilient, that they can't take things on, everything's too hard, it's too high, too big. But when push comes to shove, um, trust me, that's when you when you're really shown how resilient you are. And what's something small that brings you comfort lately? Something small that brings me comfort lately. Probably walking with you 50 kilometers away, your mum. And I better say my mother. Because you better say that. Otherwise, I'll be in big trouble. And and just spending that that um time either talking or not. Yeah. I just I just love that time. It's small, but it's, you know, something big for me. And um, once I end up going back to work and going back to the mundane, I'll be missing doing the walks. Yeah. So so that's gonna be a big change.

Speaker 1 26:33

Yeah. And I love hearing about how supportive your manager is. What a real blessing to have someone who genuinely cares about you. How much of a difference do you think it's made knowing that your workplace is there to support you?

Speaker 26:47

I think it's a big thing because that is the time when you just don't have time to think, where you just don't know where where things are going. Doctors tell you everything and anything, they give you missed diagnoses, and then they give you other random diagnoses, and then they go back to the original diagnosis, and you have tests and more tests, and and you really don't know where your head is. So to have managers that actually care, that tell you, you know what, you spend the time doing what you need to do will be fine. Whatever happens, happens. This is the time when you really need time off so that you can get well, so that when you do go back to work, you'll be able to give back your hundred percent. Because if I was to go back now, I would probably go back one or two days max. And then that's even up and down. So having that flexibility, having this amount of time off is a big bonus, and having that support from my managers is a big, big thing. So I'm very lucky.

Speaker 1 27:46

When you go back to work, what do you think the key change is going to be in how you approach your work life moving forward?

Speaker 27:52

Well, in my utopian world, I'm gonna only work until four o'clock. But I know the real carta, that'll probably last a day, and then the second day I'll go back to staying back till seven o'clock or some stupid hour because I know that I'll have work to do, that I have to catch up on all my emails, possible projects that I may need to work on, or queries that colleagues or stakeholders may need, and it's on me to give that information. So I want to try and give it as soon as possible, which means staying back and putting the time in to give them an answer. And so, as I said, I'm very hopeful, but I think that's all gonna fall to water.

Speaker 1 28:31

But even just listening to you talk about your work, you're currently going through a life-changing experience, and yet you are so passionate about going back and doing like the best job you can. What is it that you love so much about your job that you that you talk about it like this?

Speaker 28:50

I just love what I'm actually doing at work. Yes, if I moved into other areas of the organization, I might not like the work as much. But this type of work I absolutely love doing. This is my forte. This is fabulous. I have getting the opportunity to meet a lot of the stakeholders, and I just love that. It's just an interesting piece of work that we actually do in the team. The other thing that I also like are my colleagues, my management as well, make it enjoyable. So I suppose those are the three things that make me like my job.

Speaker 1 29:23

So for someone listening who doesn't love their job as much as you do, what advice would you give them?

Speaker 29:29

Try and find another job. I I understand that's easier said than done, but it's a case of just looking around, seeing what's out there, have a look at areas that you're interested in. Maybe there's other teams in your organization, perhaps look at other companies or even look overseas. Basically, the world's your oyster.

Speaker 1 29:49

And what do you know about yourself now that took a long time to learn?

Speaker 29:54

I suppose to be able to um trust myself in the sense that yes, there might be people that are smarter than me that are that are more eloquently that can speak more eloquently than than me. But I know my own true worth. So I just need to be able to recognize that and to understand my limits and know, well, that's who I am, that's how I do things, take it or leave it. So I've yeah, just learnt to take my self-worth as is and hope that it's enough.

Speaker 1 30:25

When you think about the next little while, what feels really important?

Speaker 30:29

Basically getting back to a routine, getting back to you know, having a job, having that purpose, getting back into the real world, going back to traveling, making time for friends and family, especially those that have supported me over this journey. She just rolled her eyes. Sorry, I hate that word. I hate that word. And I was been trying to avoid using it, but unfortunately, there's no other word. It came out. It came out the wrong way. Um, but yeah, who've um yeah, supported me because I I wouldn't be here without all of those people's support. Doesn't matter how small, how big, um, everything matters. Everything matters, knowing all that love that I have from family and friends, regardless if they're close by or if they're, you know, 16,000 Ks away. Doesn't matter. The um love is still there. I can feel it. Sometimes it's overwhelming. Um, you know, and you sort of go, well, just calm down, people. I'm fine. I'm still living. I'm still here, I'm still standing, yeah, yeah, yeah. Something like having dance. Um, so yeah, so so I suppose it's just trying to find that balance with the work and social time and making sure that it all balances out nicely and not have the scales tipping one way or the other.

Speaker 1 31:53

And now, the next flight that you get on to, where are you going?

Speaker 31:58

Well, I'm going back to Europe, that's for sure. Me and Europe. There's so many countries to um see. I I want to go and see Poland. Um, Romania is another country that I've been told is worth seeing. A couple of the countries that I absolutely love, Ireland. The people are just so, so friendly. Unbelievably. The the the the um roads are squashy and tiny. I survived once well, they never it's like drive real slow. Don't hit me, don't hit me, don't hit me. I'll hold great, you know. I can drive. Um, that's really good. So Ireland's fabulous. Love, love, love Cypress. People are just so friendly. Um, the roads are easy to um navigate. Um, people know English as well. The food is great, the beaches are great. I would go back in a heartbeat to um see Istanbul. Um, random country. Kosovo. Who would have thought? Little old Kosovo, another country that I had no expectations. There's just so much to see and do. Um, I'm just trying to think of a country that I haven't really liked. And I'm Oh, we don't want to upset Hungary. Let's ungo with Hungary. Why didn't I like like Hungary? Well, no one could speak English. It doesn't help when no one stands. Wasn't a possibility. There was a lot of that. Uh a lot of Google Translate. I drove into a car park and I didn't know how to get get out of the car park because I paid for it and for some reason it didn't want to accept the ticket. And of course, there's a button there to talk to somebody. And knowing that no one speaks English, there's no chance in hell. So you're just sitting there and there's a lineup of cars behind you, and they're all biffing at you, and you're just going, I don't know, I don't know what's going on. And I suppose the um guy must have felt sorry for us and said, I'll just let these foreigners just go out. And so we press the button, boom, gate went up, and off we went. So I suppose I'm, you know, you know, something positive about Hungary, but they felt sorry for me. I love that. Otherwise, you know, travels brings you the um good and bad. Generally, it's you know, bought the good out. Love it. Bought the good out.

Speaker 1 34:06

Well, thank you so much for the conversation today. Thank you for having me.

Speaker 34:16

Thank you.